Rogue 12----4/26/2004 8:38 AM----Post Number: 1

Hey everyone. I was up in Delaware this past weekend for Master Yoon's 8th Annual Delaware State Open tournament. I was excited to see such a large turnout and I was glad to meet fellow association member CMA_Casey. We were discussing the ActionFlex Swords that I have and we were wondering if any other types were available. A classmate of mine found a website that appears to have similar swords for a fairly reasonable price. The link is:

http://www.weaponmasters.com/index.html ... EM=WM-2238

Casey... I hope you see this so that you can get one for yourself. As I was telling you in Delaware, we use these quite often in class for sparring, one-step, and chook-kums. Plus, being foam.. they don't hurt as much!

DaeSan_JinHae----4/26/2004 11:47 AM----Post Number: 2


I would also recommend the "Action Bat" It's heavier than the action bat-but much stronger. I sparred a couple rounds with the students just for experimentation and I broke 2 Action Flex Swords in a row hitting it with my action bat if it says anything.I could feel my wallet empty as they broke by the way........

Rogue 12----4/26/2004 11:51 AM----Post Number: 3

Is there a website or manufacturer name for the "Action Bat"?

CandleKilla----4/26/2004 12:51 PM----Post Number: 4


I have made a bamboo sword wrapped with sponge cusion for under 3 dollars that looks very similar to most $30 commercially available swords. However, they break easily within a few hits with normal HDGD cuts. Some actionflex swords will break in the middle and become nunchaku. Durability would be the key issue.

With HDGD cuts, not many equipment could survive the abuse. When Jason and I sparred last year with kendo armors, we broke ~8 jukdos within 30 minutes.

DaeSan_JinHae----4/26/2004 1:04 PM----Post Number: 5


Here's alink for the action bat: http://store.martialartsmart.net/3507.html Hope this helps. I also took the foam "noodles" cut it and put it around a jukdo. Not pretty for sure-but about $20 cheaper than buying an action bat.

CMA-Casey----4/26/2004 11:40 PM----Post Number: 6


Thanks for the information Rogue 12. Like I mentioned during our conversation, I like the idea using the foam swords for sparring practice, but I wish they were closer to the actual weight of a mogum and still afford protection. Yeah, just another example of me wanting my cake and being allowed to eat it too. I'll probably end up with a couple nonetheless. What I'm really hoping for is the opportunity to purchase one of the HDGD sparring outfits. Watching the sparring clips Anthony provided has me wanting a set of the armor that much more.

Anthony_Boyd----4/27/2004 5:14 AM----Post Number: 7


How are the Action Bats when it comes to manipulation of the enemy blade? There are some repeated issues that crop up in sparring and blade design seems to be at the core of the problems. I like the weight that you are describing. What other characteristics do they have?

A 'sword' that is too light encourages unrealistic behaviours (such as vastly increased speed, ridiculous tapping strategies, flailing, etc). One that is too insubstantial prevents parries, ripostes, hard blocks, clears, binds, etc. leaving you with nothing to do but whack the opponent. Other limitations are length, balance point, aerodynamic properties, etc.

With the juk-to, the problems we've been having are that the tips crack off when we use them to cut across the target, or stress cracks follow the grain down the slats. They clearly were not designed for this type of application.

Although they are rigid, they are designed to negate impact. This makes certain applications, like redirects, and clears ineffective or less effective. [As an example, with moggum and ka-gum, I can clear a blade to a completely disadvantageous position for its owner with little muscular effort and a reasonable amount of movement. With Juk-to, the ablative effect of the design swallows the motive force and leaves me wishing for a gun.] Also, I find the flexibilty of the juk-to works against the successful use of presses, and any fancy leverage uses. Still, despite this it is still too rigid to safely use for thrusts against soft or no armour. What's a guy to do?

Despite all of this negativity, I still prefer juk-to to any of the padded blades I have tried. I have not given up hope, however, that modern technology can give us the answer.

Rogue 12----4/27/2004 8:21 AM----Post Number: 8

The concerns about the weight are very true. Going from the mokgum or jukdo to the action flex is a dramatic change and everyone is right, that it does often promote a false sense of speed and security. One thing I have noticed is that there is a certain amount of 'give' when sparring with these swords as opposed to say the bamboo.

In looking at the Action Bat it looks as if it is a little sturdier and heavier and would likely help give a more realistic experience. Still, without armor, it is difficult to use the bamboo to do sparring at full speed (my ear will never forget the hit it endured during one class!)

I showed Casey my foam covered mokgum which is similar to the wooden ones in terms of weight, however, there is a layer of foam around the actual sword so it pads it a little. It will still hurt but it won't hurt quite as much. These can be seen at many martial arts supplies stores (even on Amazon -- search for foam daito)

Again, without armor it is a little risky to spar with these, but I'm sure we'll find something soon enough. Also, checkout the Realistic Sparring Weapons (http://www.rsw.com.hk/products.htm). They list a Japanese Katana that is supposed to be weighted to actual sword weight but still is safe enough to use during sparring.

Anthony_Boyd----4/27/2004 9:12 AM----Post Number: 9


I am planning to go to Hong Kong at some point this summer and if that works out I plan to hook up with the RSW group to see what they do first hand. If that comes to fruition, I will report back on what I find out.

As an aside, I saw the weirdest thing today at the dojang: an aluminum moggum. Not a ka-gum. This was an aluminum "sword" in the shape of a moggum. Silvery blade part with a black rubber sheath over the handle. It had the same weight and movement characteristics of a moggum. Weird.

DaeSan_JinHae----4/27/2004 12:06 PM----Post Number: 10


That RSW group seemed pretty interesting. Although they had none in stock-if they had I probably would have ordered one on the spot. The action bat is very heavy-probably heavier than mok gum, maybe even jin gum. Not very aerodynamic, but for those of us without access to federation sparring gear it's a good trade off to a juk do. We just put on our regular karate sparring gear and it's fine. When you get hit with the action bat, because of the weight, you feel like you got whacked with a juk go with a rolled up newspaper in the end (an old trick my master uses in Korea to teach some less humble students a lesson). I haven't sparred with any one of any good skill yet-so I can't claim the action bat a good tool for hard core sparring. I do know that I broke 4 action flex foam swords in 20 minutes using the action bat.

CandleKilla----4/28/2004 1:26 AM----Post Number: 11


I just learned that new 'official' federation armor and sparring swords are coming soon, likely to be revealed at the championship.

Anthony_Boyd----4/28/2004 2:40 AM----Post Number: 12


Considering the opposition that Chong Jae-Nim has to sparring, developments like these always catch my attention.

When the new logo was introduced to mark the armour I was worried that there was going to be a new splinter group centered in Seoul with the dojangs who have embraced sparring. This weekend, my instructor in Uijeongbu received a shipment of the armour marked with the same logo. Acceptance seems to be growing slowly and upward from the base rather than down from the top.

The current version of the armour is good and a lot better than the prototype revealed in 2002. I would like to see a few changes made and hopefully my wishes will be granted soon. I know all the people who went home with bruised and or broken thumbs from the competition 2 weeks ago are praying with me!


More on that aluminum "moggum". It has a sliding weight inside, presumably to help the novice get the feel for a proper cut. Noisy, but interesting.